In answer to the question, yes, I do think us being so close to Wigan has affected our attendances, but always has done. Crusaders on the other hand are a new team to "your area", and would possibly (if the doomsayers were to be believed) have led to fair weather supporters from (for example) the Chester area deserting you to head into Wrexham.



As for the digs at Leigh, we'll see what the situation is when we meet....

Leighs cup final.

This thread is just mischief making on Niks part. We will see how the crusaders go in the long term, we've seen massive crowds from new teams before, in the meantime, it's still nothing to do with us. But nice try Nik.

It isn't mischief making at all Chris, as a passionate supporter of expansion I noticed when the relocation of the Crusaders franchise that there was a lot of talk in the VT that they would be taking fans from established clubs. My view was that it wouldn't happen, and that it would bring new spectators to the sport, especially in Wrexham, a large town with no real sporting presence that is full of ex North Westerners.



No trolling intended, I was just curious if this actually had happened.

Could've fooled me Nik. Thing is, Wrexham and Widnes might be close geographically but not culturally. Our Welsh contingeant is not all that large and you're unlikely to dent our figures with a club there.



I would say our current crowd decreases are more to do with the licensing saga and the inevitable bad feeling towards a team that has its ambitions capped by "passionate supporters of expansion". People who would see clubs like Oldham go to the wall just to see a sham team in Sunbury on Thames.



The longer we're stuck in this division with the current feeling of scepticism towards the governing body of the sport the more the crowds will drop, and every club are going to suffer the same fate.

I grew up in Wrexham, and can tell you without a shadow of doubt that there has always been a large RL following in the town (hence my interest in their impact on SL). I knew as many english as welsh when I was growing up on the outskirts in the late 70s/early 80s.



And yes, I would see Oldham go to the wall. I'd also see Leigh or Widnes go if there was the obvious lack of interest in the game in the area as there obviously is no interest in the game in Oldham, certainly compared to Wrexham or Catalonia. I wouldn't say I'd be happy to see them go but you can't keep throwing money at clubs that are failing, its no wonder the RFL is only just turning its finances around after years of paddling a holed canoe.

I'm not saying that Broncos are my ideal team, but at least I can understand that without a London club, there will be no Sky money. Without Sky money there will be no SLE. Without SLE, RL will continue the slide into obscurity that had started before its creation. So a London club is a necessary evil in the game.

Conversely, Catalan and Crusaders (to date, I'm not shouting too loudly about Crusaders crowds yet though, give it a second season of good attendances) are showing that you can grow the sport outside it's recent heartland core. So two out of three successes, with one necessary evil isn't a bad result.



Incidentally, I used the word "recent" rather than "traditional" as it is only the post war era where the game has retreated to the North of England. The expanisionists are just reclaiming historic bases.

So which one is it? Keep Harlequins or let them die?

He always used to go and watch whichever team had a game he liked the look of, but why he would head over to Wrexham when he could get to St Helens far easier is beyond me. Still, he earns it so I suppose he can spend it as he likes.

There is a lot of interest in the game around Oldham, just as there is in Widnes, Leigh and Cumbria. Don't confuse lack of interest in the biggest clubs in those places with any lack of interest in the game of rugby league. The amateur game is thriving in those places. I can't think of any amateur team in or around Wrexham.

i love these expansionists who've been following the european super league for 15 years.god knows how many millions of euro's later & theres still only one team from the mainland.you just could'nt make it up.if it was'nt so ridiculous i'd p1ss myself laughing.

Letting hundreds of year old clubs die and replacing them with struggling teams in pockets of the country is not expansion, its a relocation, and one that leaves us significantly worse off. You would allow Oldham to go to the wall?



You're pathetic mate. People like you with pie in the sky ideas and a tactless disregard for history and existing fans are exactly what is wrong with this game. Instead of having a game which is ran by people trying to strengthen the game as a whole we have a bunch of one eyed morons who are actually more worried about how others think about us than serving existing fans.



This is our game. We made it, for us, because rugby as was wouldn't allow us to grow.



There is no point growing the game even to be intergalactic if you take it out of our hands, because that's just a sport someone else is enjoying. I wouldn't even sacrifice leigh for a team elsewhere, there's no point. I would encourage growth elsewhere, but simply tossing a franchise in the outer hebrides and shouting "catch" wont work and if we as a sport neglect our stronghold we will weaken to a degree we may never recover from.



And I have yet to see one piece of evidence to suggest sky would pull their cash without the current sham that is Quins. It's conjecture, and probably nonsense. We're already underpaid for the viewers we bring in, and our media coverage in the capital is still negligeable and doesn't improve when Quins are doing well so I fail to see that argument. If we got rid of them, we'd be in roughly the same position. I'd suggest we don't need to just yet and I wouldn't relegate them tomorrow but neither would I prioritise them above the Oldhams of this world, rugby league runs deep there and we'll lose a lot if we give it up entirely. The London question is too complex to be summed up in one paragraph but let's not pretend they are some sacred cow rugby league cannot survive without.



People like you honestly make me laugh. You'd be happy for rugby league to completely lose the whole north of england as long as it was massively popular elsewhere. What on earth would be the point of that?

Tbf There is a history of League in the south of France.