You guessed i was there to slag off players because i was supporting one of them? thats a pretty strange jump of logic, Since you were defending mguire earlier on in the thread does that mean you went to the tournemount soley to cheer on your own clubs players and to boo those of other clubs?

I was supporting them all, for me there club didnt matter while they were playing in that tournemount, i did watch the players who were new especially though such as shenton, easmond, tompkins, bridge and crabtree. I never said shenton was defensivley perfect, indeed there is no such player (at least not to my knowledge) but he was our best back in defence, he managed to restrict the aussies to just two tries down in his side for about 145 minutes which is about as good or better than i can remember any England/Great britain centre doing for the last 10 years, he did more tackling than any other back and hardly missed one and made a couple of very important tackles (the one where he chased down an aussie player that had broken through and forced a knock on was top notch, as was him combining with hall to send an aussie player into touch near the england line) which considering this was his debut tournemount is pretty good.



I've attempted to check it on video, unfortunatly the 'highlights video' available has very little game footage and thats at ground level with the players blocking most of the action. As far as i'm aware your the only one on this thread that has blamed shenton for anything (apart from being knocked unconcious) and i cant recall shenton being blamed at the time of the tournemount (any chance to blame a cas player for england losing would have been a bandwagon that many wouldnt have been able to resist jumping on). So we have only your opinion, and since you have singled out shenton defence as a crucial reason we lost despite the vast majority of points scored by the aussies in both games were at the other side of the field (at least whilst shenton was on the field) and shenton being our best back in defence, you dont come off as the most objective or reliable source.

Mcguire has carried a team this season without burrow and sinfield and he has done 80% of the kicking when they haven't been on the field. If mcguire comes nowhere near the aussies tomkins and myler are light years away. If you still think mcguire is a support player i suggest you watch a game from after 2005. Tomkins, Eastmond and Myler have all played in teams which are doing well and a lot of players look like world beaters when the pack is dominating but none have played in a team like Leeds this year which has been hit by injury and stood out.

Wasn't there the same number of tries scored down his side in the half a match he was off injured and the rest of the quad nations? Best defensive back by a mile in my view.

I will say it again IMO McG is a player that relies on speed and footwork. The rest of his game is lacking IMO. Compare him too Eastmond, Tomkins and Myler and i think he does not have the skills that these players possess. Then compare Danny to the Aussies and it is men and boys mate. I think the Leeds halves are one trick ponies that for years have had Sinny to do the organising/kicking which has made up for the skill areas in which they are lacking. I respect your opinion as everyone has a right to one. But we will have to agree to disagree on this one as this is my view.

He was only injured for around 15 minutes iirc.

The problem is there is an excellent team work ethic at Leeds. Mcguire lacks the creativity and skill to organise a team. Watch how many times he runs at the defensive line and then doubles back because he has run out of ideas. If the gap isn't there for himself then he struggles. He has proven year after year that he might score tries but he is NOT an International Half Back. Out of the 4 half backs, Tomkins, Myler, Mcguire & Eastmond, Tomkins is the only one in my opinion that looks like he can play as an international 6 consistently. Myler is overrated and Eastmond can be brilliant on his day but lacks consistency at International Level. Still Eastmond & tomkins for me should be put in at 6&7 at every opportunity and build the team around them. Mcguire had his chance and failed on numerous occasions.

he's played 3 internationals..........

Theres a few on here who are stuck in 2005.

Since then McGuires has developed his all round game and is Leeds most potent attacking force. He tops the try assists every season, organises, has an excellent short kicking game and has won many a game for Leeds which we haven't deserved to win with a try out of nothing. If he played for any other club he would be acknowledged to be a good player by all.

He had one poor game last year, the tournament before (the World Cup) he was excellent, watch the World Cup semi against NZ - if you dispute that he was quality you are sadly lacking in your knowledge or can't see past your anti Leeds bias.

and one of those he came off the bench and played a position he has never played before.

Gotta be a Wiganer.

I agree, mcguire is far more than the support player he once was, as burrows form has diminished his seems to have improved, His main problem for me is his defence, if he could improve that he should be in the mix for international selection. The problem is who does he replace both eastmond and tompkins are naturally differant players who will get better the more internationals they play and will surpass mcguire imho as they are both better players than mcguire was at there age.



Bit misleading saying he is top for try assists by the way, he hasnt been top for try assists, he is currently 8th and before that has been 10th, 7th 2nd and 7th. Which is good but on average he is out of the top 5, so you cant really say he 'tops the try assists'.

Sorry, i was a bit vague. He is top at Leeds for try assists.